There are a lot of presumption here about the health of the planet with FD vs. current alternatives and the overall footprint 20 Associated stores have vs. a 300,000 sq/ft facility for FD. Objectors’ “the suburbs suck…” comment typifies the one track vision of those that think there is only one solution which further restricts change because those that oppose it see nothing to compromise with (goes both ways). I believe the employees need to have certain practices re-inforced – shutting the trucks down, packing more effectively. This clearly comes from a corporate level and perhaps higher pay to make them more concerned about their role but imagine if FD:

- Used Bio-diesel fuel and enforced the shutting down of trucks while the cooling mechanism still functioned.
- Packed more effectively or utilized an alternative packaging solution.
- Leveraged more CSA/local businesses to re-sell products (other than the food Co-op I dont see any other place provide more alternatives for me in this regard).

Would this be more acceptable or will the presence of trucks always be trumped by a green market or CSA/Co-op? They apparently plan on doing the above although I’m sure there will be critics. I have lived in 3 boroughs, New Jersy and Long Island in my 40 years in the area and believe that there is always room for improvement in all business models and compromise, whether forced or volunteered, benefits the majority. In the case of environmental impact I don’t see FD as the evil empire as many of you do. The technology/internet era has arrived and can streamline many processes – not always for the better but instead of opening up a farm and saying change is bad let’s see how we can improve and create an acceptable alternative. The loss of traditional jobs/roles can then be supplemented by new ones.
The class issue is significant. I’m interested in seeing the racial and socio-economic demographic of eco-friendly (CSA/Park Slope food Co-op/Green Market,etc…) customers in the city. My personal experience has shown me that many of the working class, non-white families (like the one I grew up in) are not patronizing these options. We bought what we could afford and what we could get home during the time both my parents worked. Kool-Aid was popular as well as other unhealthy and eco-unfriendly products. Why do you think that is? Well, first of all, they were cheap as most mass produced items are. Secondly, we had no choice but to go to the local store and bus it home so whatever they had we bought. Lastly, we were too busy surviving to consider our eco-footprint.
How much are the FD drivers making and you curse them on your bike or in the taxi that is stuck behind them as you head to the Williamsburg bar that your friend is jamming tonight? How do you raise a family and buy eco-friendly products on 8-10 and hour? Let’s look at the advantages we can leverage – this is New York CITY and there will always be a vast array of people from all walks of life so working as a group in an urban landscape should help this move along effectively for everyone.

I am not a pickle fan but I will check them out. Your post was very interesting and you seem to be thinking about the bigger picture and I really respect that. As a small business owner myself, I weigh the cost of doing business vs environmental cost at every turn.

I am an NYC person as well and I will also echo “objector’s” suggestion of visiting the green market. Not only does Trader Joe’s have food from so far away but the amount of packaging for each and every product is unbelievable.

Carry a small tote in your bag, visit the Union Sq. green market open 4 days a week. Talk about “Not Eating Out In NYC”. Prepare to be dazzled. Eating in season is also a suggestion. You don’t reeeeally need an avocado in December.

Best to everyone.

matt, sure you’re busy, we’re all busy, but the point is we HAVE TO learn to make choices irrespective of our “needs.” when my only choice is starbucks, or i’ve forgotten my cup, guess what? i don’t BUY a coffee. when your busyness means environmental degradation, on both a macro (global warming) and micro (belching exhaust in peoples homes/streets, avalanches of cardboard)level, i don’t think it’s an excuse.

like i said, i grew up here, and my parents were plenty busy. but they both managed (and manage still) to get food into their houses without fresh direct. i am as busy as anyone i know, and i don’t “need” fresh direct.

be honest- you WANT fresh direct, you don’t NEED it. nobody NEEDS it, except maybe the elderly and handicapped who are trapped in their houses and apartments, but few of them can afford it. meals-on-wheels can let their trucks idle on my block all they want (though they don’t- the times i see them deliver they’re fast, and turn off their engines).

force fresh direct to start bicycle delivery- for the busy people. and yeah, when the special-food-for-rich-people trucks are making all the rest of us late (i’ve been stuck behind those trucks plenty of times) and giving the poor kids asthma, and costing the city millions in extra waste-disposal costs, well then we’re all “paying” for your convenience. which is bullshit.

this is the problem with the current capitalist model- someone makes money at the expense of the environment, and we all pay to have it cleaned up. and/or we suffer the consequences (trucks, exhaust, garbage).

Saigon- i’d say that your csa delivery system is the sort of thing that justifies delivery- supporting as it does local agriculture, organic farming, and reusable packaging. sounds like a very sustainable model to me. stick with it! maybe they’ll get waste veggie-oil powered trucks someday? or bike delivery carts?

fresh direct allows one to specify delivery to the hour, which means i’ve seen half empty trucks pull up to a building, vomit out a stack of boxes for someone who wanted delivery at 6:30: that truck sits and, yes, idles, for 15 minutes. Ten minutes later another mostly empty truck will pull up, TO THE SAME ADDRESS and vomit out ANOTHER load, for another tenant.
i sit on my stoop in the summertime and have seen this many times- i live on a sparsely populated block of small townhouses, not huge buildings, and 75% of the time there’s a fresh direct truck sitting, pulling up or pulling away.

angela: have you checked where your trader joe’s is coming from? it’s great that you subway it home, but as most of their produce is coming from far, far away (much of their frozen food comes from china, some comes from india) you may be doing more damage than you thought.

as long as you’re on 14th street, why not head over to the green market (open monday wednesday friday and saturday…and there’re great ones in brooklyn on saturdays too- williamsburg and downtown) ? you can freeze your own stuff, in season, and save the circum-global schlep.

bob- congratulations on your business, and thanks for caring about more than just the bottom line. csa’s are a great answer, and so is weaning ourselves off of things like bananas and french wines. i’m not saying NEVER, but the market for bananas was “created” a hundred years ago- before then we did fine without them. there’s good local wine, and vinegar, albeit not balsamic.

have you considered using standard canning jars for your pickles, which could be reused by those of us who do our own canning at home? or collected and donated to groups that can for food pantries and the poor? just a thought….

i’ll be sure to look for your pickles.

My brother and I run McClure’s Pickles and for the past year we’ve been growing quickly. We have been distributing our product to our retail customers for the past year now and every time I am making a delivery, there is usually 1 or 2 additional trucks making deliveries as well (either distributors or producers trucks), and yeah..tend to be idling b/c of refrigeration, etc. but ultimately…the products that we enjoy have to get to those retail stores. And if using a distributor…that product is gonna get shipped from wherever it is made…stored in a warehouse…then shipped to the retail store. So…is Fresh Direct, helping to cut back environmental impact in one way by purchasing as they state on their site, “directly from farms, dairies and fisheries (not middlemen), so it’s several days fresher and a lot less expensive when it gets to your table.”? And in another way, negatively impacting the environment through excessive product packaging and logistics?

It’s an interesting dilemma…we want to be able to enjoy the foods we like year round, and the only way for that to occur is through local and global logistics…otherwise goodbye bananas, some balsamic vinegars, many wines and cheeses, etc.

The farmer’s markets and CSA’s seem to be the way in which we cut back on environmental impact…although the farmer then requires a way to get their product to market.

I imagine that Fresh Direct has as part of their financial plan where they are not running 1/4 and 1/2 loads for delivery…that would cost them too much money.

Joe and I are currently negotiating with a distributor who will work to place our product throughout the northeast region. We are happy for the growth, but at what price? The product we get is grown nearby or driven in from somewhere…we drive to pick it up…we make the product…put it on a pallet and have a semi-truck deliver to me in Brooklyn, where I get in a Zipcar or hand deliver — or the product gets shipped to a distributor warehouse where it then gets put on another truck for delivery to retail store. And when I’m making batches in Brooklyn, I have pretty much the same process. So without this distribution…we would limit our growth, right?

I think what’s important is that we keep searching and implementing ways to reduce impact & waste…(eg. Recycling our jars, using recycled paper labels, etc.). There will be ways we can do so which are more in our control and others not so much.

Interesting to note, that Fresh Direct has on premise baking, meat and food prep.

Here’s a link to a Industrial news site I read (cheesy yes…but if you’re interested in global local industry…there’s some good info to find out how it all impacts our day-to-day grind)

http://www.industrialnewsupdate.com/

and here’s a link to a piece on Fresh Direct:
http://www.industrialnewsupdate.com/news/logistics-shipping/archives/2006/01/online_grocer_f.php

I think the packaging industry is pretty fucked and another issue which can be debated upon.

I don’t have any for-sure answers and as a business owner, I want to see growth and prosperity at a level which does not undermine our core-values and also want to be as impact-Less as I can afford to be.

Great post Cathy!

In Seattle I’ve been getting bi-weekly deliveries from Pioneer Organics, a CSA (Community supported agriculture) for a few months. The produce is organic, local, seasonal and the farms are mostly co-ops – often from small farms that sell only through this service or farmer’s markets. I’m not sure what Fresh Direct is – is it just any kind of grocery delivered? I tried to look at the site, but it won’t let you in without a zip code (which I tried entering a random Manhattan zip and it didn’t work…

I like pioneer organics, some of the best fruit I’ve ever had. They use re-useable bins, which we swap out, and they deliver on a schedule to limit their driving (no next day delivery). I also eat fruits/veggies outside of my usual repetoire (I wouldn’t normally buy kale, but when it shows up, I figure something out) since it’s seasonal and whatever is growing at the time is what I get. I don’t feel like this service is wasteful, but you’ve all got me thinking about it.

I think a distinction should be drawn between trend-mongering “foodies” – ever searching for the new tidbit, the latest ethno-taste fad, the hippest dining spot — and those more holistically concerned about our food — where it comes from, the people who grow and harvest it, the soil it’s grown in, what’s added to it, how it gets to us, and only then, what we, the eaters, do with it. It’s a no-brainer that what previous posters tout as the convenience of a brilliant business model is not necessarily good for the health of the planet, which, of course, means our health as well. Capitalism, with its property-fetishism, is largely anathema to the environment. More trucks on the street mean worse air, more asthma, more compromised immune systems, greater and greater long term costs, etc., but we need to remember that if they aren’t on our streets they’re on the streets of the warehouse districts, which are usually where the poor live. But by now we should all know that the planet is a commons; air, water, & soil all register the poison we put into it, and it all works its way back to us. The abandonment of the nation’s rail system, the long delay in constructing a vital rail tunnel under the Hudson, in favor of highways and semis, are all coming back to haunt us. People made those decisions, usually a very small number of people. People now can make other decisions, both collectively and individually (it takes more than hope, it takes action). Meanwhile, food cooperatives, CSAs, & urban farms are viable, necessary alternatives.